Hebraic-Roots Version NT Plagiarism

by Steven Avery

We suggest that if you are contacted by any of these people exposed on

this site or those defending them that you do not enter into debate with them

as we have been confronting them on their sin for years without any sign

of repentance or acknowledgement. When certain people see their income

come under attack, they get very defensive and refuse to listen to Scripture.

There is nothing one can do to change them and you will be exhausting

yourself needlessly.

“For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge

those who are inside? But Elohim judges those who are outside.

And put away the wicked one from among you!”

1 Corinthians 5:11-13

14) HRV Tanach
15) MotivationsBibliography .... Source List.

TO BE COMPLETED

REWRITE AND CORRECT SOME SECTIONS ESPECIALLY FOOTNOTE 8recantation / Trimm slander
Naz Forums
Detweiler.
ARAMAIC == pagan
Book of Mormon
Arest
Two new thingies.. Christian forum and eliyah
OT Footnote and info
Promotion Footnote and

SPELLING LIST

And we must wonder about those who continue to defend and work with and promote such an illicit work, members of his Beit Din (16), moderators of web forums that squash the integrity issue of plagiarism, and folks who blithely look to James as an authority in spiritual matters despite knowing the truth of the HRV. And the organizations like YATI that turned a blind eye to the plagiarism.

Schmuel@bigfoot.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/

and all associated in the leadershipThose still connected to the organization leadership need to come clean with a complete public separation from SANJ. Although it is very late in the day, such statements could save some of their credibility.

Doctor Kiraz is a real Aramaic scholar, with a real language doctorate, a Master's degree in Syriac Studies (Oxford University, 1991). He is founder and President of Beth Mardutho,The Syriac Institute, and his web page is http://home.flash.net/~malel/George.htm . General Editor of Hugoye: Journal of Syriac Studies and author of the "Comparative Edition of the Syriac Gospels: Aligning the Old Syriac Sinaiticus, Curetonianus, Peshitta and Harklean Versions John”. We have taken Paul Younan’s assertion here at face,

======================================================================================

James Trimm - Hebraic-Roots Version NT Plagiarism 1/19/04

by Steven Avery schmuel@nyc.rr.comSANJ
On the Internet, the Society for the Advancement of Nazarene Judaism SANJ (1) has been a phenom over the last few years. SANJ has maintained a number of active email forums with hundreds of participants, a web site, various articles and publications, and an occasional IRC text chat room. SANJ was probably the first Messianic-ish oriented organization whose to use the Internet as their primary communication tool. In fact, other than a couple of small conferences, almost all the activities of the SANJ organization has been Internet-based. And , by the nature of the Internet, SANJ was able to impact internationally. A friend of mine was promoting SANJ material in Israel, where I even met one of their former Beit Din members from Australia.

And I myself enjoyed the various Nazarene email forums back in the early days, there was an energy and innocence and lots of spirited dialog. As time went on, often I would defend James Trimm from some of his harsher doctrinal critics (at times I was even defending him on the Internet in discussions with Moishe Rosen, founder of Jews for Jesus), while, on the other hand, pointing out weaknesses to those who would give him and his views accolades.. For some agreements with James, see (2). And for a short discussion of motivations for this article (3).
CONTROVERSY
Yet often there has been controversy over the years, involving James Trimm. Many questions, about scholarship, motives, ethics and doctrines (4) arose.

· The strange history of Mormon interest (5) and posturing (or play-acting), with James revealed as "Rabbi Yosef", aka "Yosef ben Yehudah".

· The propagating of kabbalistic teachings was viewed by many with dismay.

· James claim of Jewish upbringing was exposed as a stretch, and self-serving

· The SANJ organization, with its Beit Din, had controversies on many issues

· The Yeshiva had similar controversies, especially about faculty and degree claims, and the linkage with MBI Yeshiva.

· The SANJ organization had serious issues raised on customer service and monetary issues.

· Personal issues were raised as well. (6)

In general, James' public responses on these issues are at www.trimmfamily.com/slander.htm (7).

Our concern here however, is specifically the Hebraic-Roots-Version, the HRV, and issues directly germane to this version, which has been heavily promoted for sale. Most especially on the Internet, and through email forums, where scholarly insight is somewhat uneven.

Integrity in the Scriptures is extremely significant to the Messianic Community. Confusing a translation of the Dvar Elohim with a crafty, blatantly dishonest plagiarism will affect our whole understanding of that most precious gift, the Dvar Elohim, the Word of God. Other issues in regard to James will be lightly addressed in this article, mostly in footnotes. The following are issues that directly relate to the plagiarism.
THREE ISSUES THAT RELATE DIRECTLY TO THE HRV PLAGIARISM

· Exposure of James' ultra-dubious academic doctorate claim, with the home-made cooked transcript, from a seminary operating essentially without professors, curriculum or students.

· James language expertise is questioned, as James passed on challenges to demonstrate any conversational ability in Semitic languages. And one could in addition often observe the very low skill level of his English writing output. (8)

· The legitimacy of the earlier Book of Matthew translation (B'sorot Matti) was questioned.

Documentation showed it was created from other sources than James’ his own translating. In other

Words it was plagiarized, while James claimed it as an original translation.

     All of this set the stage for our Hebraic Roots Version study. First we will examine James' claimed doctorate and claimed Aramaic expertise The Book of Matthew earlier plagiarism we will discuss in a footnote.

=========================================================================
DOCTORATE

     Bearing directly on "Dr." James Trimm’s supposed expertise to do a Scripture translation would be his claimed doctorate, from "St. John Chrysostom Theological Seminary". (The name has come forth with a number of variants).
     Interestingly, James "jumped" from a high school equivalency diploma right to a doctorate, without even passing Go to pick up a Bachelors or Masters, a rather unique achievement.

     We summarized the doctorate issues, after some research, in a post on the Messianic_Apologetic email forum.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5202
Schmuel Tue Jul 22, 2003 12:24 pm
[Messianic_Apologetic] St. Johns Theological Seminary & Transcript, Diploma, Doctorate
(extracts)SUMMARY OF CLAIMED DOCTORATE (AND TRANSCRIPT) OF JAMES TRIMM
St. Johns Theological Seminary - in the 1990's
--- no accreditation
--- no known address
--- transcript shown by James Trimm, name of institution misspelled
--- transcript done on cheap word processor, lacking professors, dates and other basic info
--- transcript gives an appearance of home-made, not from an institution
--- no professors known for any of the 39 courses, or for the Seminary as a whole--- correspondence courses, (it is now claimed post-facto) yet no known materials of the courses
--- no known students, for all 39 courses, other than James Trimm

Clearly, this was not a valid doctorate(9). Nor was this a legitimate degree-granting institution(10). Not in the sense of the degree representing ANYTHING about academic prowess, excellence, or background. James likes to say that the degree was not “illegal” or “fraudulent”, specific legal words.

We can accept that Don Hargis actually gave James a doctorate, and there is no legal standard for receiving such a grant. What is apparent is that the “doctorate” is academically worthless. To call such a doctorate anything but worthless and phoney cheapens the concept of a doctorate for who actually work hard on specific courses in a accepted educational institution, from George Kiraz to Michael Brown to Maurice Robinson and others.

ARAMAIC AND HEBRAIC COMPETENCE

     Another issue also bears directly on James' academic competence to do an Aramaic Scripture translation. How familiar is James with Aramaic and Hebrew, and can a translator with minimal language background and assistance do a good translation solely from book learning ?

     Competence in translation is not something acquired easily, even for those who have spoken a language conversationally for years. There is no indication James has ever spoken conversational Aramaic, and even his elementary conversational Hebrew skills have been questioned.

     One of the most respected men in Aramaic Bible circles is Paul Younan of www.peshitta.org,
raised in the Assyrian culture and fully fluent in Aramaic.

Under "forums" at Peshitta.org there is the following thread
http://www.peshitta.org/forums/forumid6/1952.htmlPaul Younan 5. "RE: Dr. Trimm on AramaicNT.org" Jun-08-2003
     To be completely honest with you, I find it very annoying to argue with someone who can't even speak Aramaic, about Aramaic. James Trimm is a student. He learned whatever little he knows from reading books. That's not a bad thing. What is bad is when he sets himself up as some sort of authority on the topic, which he is not. What's worse is that he insists on arguing with me about the meaning of words he has no clue about, about a language that is completely foreign to him and that he can't even hold a 30-second discussion in, face-to-face.... Nobody who really knows a spit of Aramaic pays any attention to him, as Dr. Kiraz (10) will attest to you.
And Vicky Dillen of www.seekgod.ca  (11) posted this in at www.seekgod.ca/trfactor2.htm Michael Rood & James Trimm & The WAY

     Surprisingly, there is even a similar report on James' Hebrew competence, as well as the Aramaic above. Although it comes from an anti-mish (anti-missionary) source, so must be judged as possibly biased. We will point out that in our own times listening to James Trimm on Paltalk, he never engaged anyone in even minimal Hebrew dialog. If the report below is not true, or even exaggerated, James could disprove anytime it by chatting with one of the fluent believers on Paltalk voice chat, like our friend "Cheref Pifiyot". We would welcome listening in on such a discussion, My name on Paltalk is Praxeus.http://www.seekgod.ca/trfactor2.htm
Michael Rood & James Trimm & The WAY
"....in the Messianic Q&A chat on PalTalk.... With one simple question in simple Hebrew I demonstrated that James Trimm….knew less Hebrew than the average Israeli child in pre-school (i.e., 3-4 year old)"
---------------------------------------------------------
Quick Translation Despite No Language Fluency

     The lack of real language competence leads to the next question of how James could possibly manage such a quick translation of the New Testament from ancient Aramaic into English .. any good translation takes time, even for experts, as any who have followed the Original Bible Project (now renamed to the Transparent English Version) involving Dr. James Tabor would know :-) Dr. Tabor began his translation project of the Bible, NT and Tanach, over 10 years ago, and it is moving along, carefully but with no completion date announced.

     And all this leads into the critical issue with James Trimm, the HRV.

========================================================================

DVAR ELOHIM - THE INTEGRITY OF THE WORD OF GOD
     One issue has now come forth that is far, far more relevant to the Messianic community than any other, as it strikes directly at the Integrity of the Dvar Elohim, the Word of God.

HEBRAIC-ROOTS VERSION
     James Trimm in 2003 has released a Hebraic-Roots Version (HRV) New Testament. Many folks sent many dollars in advance and waited for this NT, thinking that it would be an original translation from Aramaic and Hebrew manuscripts, as James claimed in promotion. If fact, it turns out that the great bulk of it is simply a plagiarism (8), from an version produced by the Way International (13) with the title, The Aramaic-English Interlinear New Testament, which we will call the AEINT. The Matthew (14) chapter of the HRV is from a previous work by James Trimm, also a plagiarism, from other sources.

     The Way has been described as a secretive, cultish group, but really that is not the relevant issue here. Note that since this AEINT was designed for inhouse use, rather than public distribution, it has not been not available at all, not even verse quotes, for perusal in any manner on the Internet, and it is even difficult to find out any information from sources like Amazon or Barnes & Noble. Obtaining this version is difficult. Mostly the AEINT was known to members of the Way International, and in addition some men who specialize in the rather small world of Peshitta translation. Ergo, the ideal version to use surreptitiously as a base text, while publicly declaring an "original translation".

ARAMAIC-ENGLISH INTERLINEAR NEW TESTAMENT

     So, we find that the AEINT is primarily a copy of a translation from the Aramaic Peshitta. Ironically the Peshitta is not even the text that James was purporting to translate his Aramaic from, he waspurporting to translate directly from the Old Syriac. (15)

    The AEINT was used as the base underlying text for most of the HRV. Overall, it is easy to see that the AEINT is a mediocre translation, passable only, by examining its English for clarity and arrangement and grammar. The Aramaic scholars consider it a reasonable resource, both as an Interlinear (always helpful in scholarship), and as a help to future translation endeavors. Plus the AEINT as published by The Way International has a King James Bible for comparison. Not surprisingly, James did not include the Interlinear page, or the King James Bible, in the HRV.

     We give more description below. Others can comment more on how faithful the AEINT is or isn't to the Aramaic Peshitta, but that is not relevant to the plagiarism issue. James, ironically, himself, had spoken of this AEINT version (which we will show below in detail), many years ago..
                               James Trimm - " I do not recomend the translation "MODIFICATIONS - The Maxtrix of Changes to the AEINT TextIn most of the NT, this AEINT text was only modified to the HRV on very specified parameters.
a) Hebraizations ( God-->Eloah Jesus-->Yeshua Jerusalem--->Yerushalayim)
b) Nazarene-izations ( preach-->proclaim gospel-->good news baptizing-->immersing)
c) Capitalization - the first word of (almost) each verse.
d) A small amount of updating based on Old Syriac readings and some "Semitic idiom" changes, which we will describe as James' pet "value-added" modification matrix. (16)
     These changes cannot be considered remotely as translation. For example, substituting Yeshua for Jesus can even be done in a "global search and replace" on a word processor. Only d) even requires any independent effort, and that work only affects a very small percentage of text and can be accomplished by using English-language sources to which James has access.

     So, this plagiarism was so blatant, that anyone who is interested in the integrity of the Messianic movement and/or the Aramaic Texts, should examine the evidence.

     The primary credit for discovering and exposing this plagiarism goes to a sister named Kathryn Kern, whose website is at http://www.lebtahor.com . We thank her deeply for her labors, and her concern for the Integrity of the Word of God. Largely thanks to Kathryn, many have been aided, both spiritually, in not following a false teacher with false self-serving "theories", and of course in preserved finances. Although no cash refunds have been given by SANJ, at least many folks have stopped contributing down this pseudo-Messianic donation black hole. Kathryn has contributed more than anybody to understanding what has occurred with the SANJ-Trimm HRV.

     Partly due to the unfolding history of discovering this information, Kathryn's web analysis includes some of the earlier personal problems to which I have paid little attention, although for some these issues do in fact cut very, very deep. Similarly, Kathryn discusses the question of whether SANJ qualifies as a cult or cultish. This discussion is of little import here, where we are staying right on the Integrity issue, seeking to help expose the opportunism and deception that led to plagiarism of the Word of God.

HRV-AEINT COMPARISON

BACKGROUND AND HISTORY - RESEARCH OF KATHRYNhttp://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/hrvpage.htm STARTING URL HRV - Hebraic Roots New Testament Background, including the methodology of using a base English text and modifying, discussed by James Trimm (Rabbi Yosef) vis a vis a Jewish Book of Mormon project he had been planning.

Now, we are going to share further links from this page directly related to the HRV plagiarism.http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/waysearch.htm
James.TrimmNewsgroups: soc.religion.christian WAY INTL & ARAMAIC NT 6 Dec 93
James Trimm's Search For Way Members- 1993 - (helpful for background)Here is avery significant historical post from 1993, which ultimately blew James' attempted cover stories. (which were absurd probability-wise, as well). Spelling by Trimm :-)http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/altmesstrimmway.html
alt.messianic 1993 James Trimm New Testament In Aramaic 1993-12-11
> TITLE: [Bible. N.T. Syriac. 1992.]
> Aramaic-English interlinear New Testament / edited by
> the Way International Research Team.Yes I am aware of the edition you mention, which is an interliniar of the Peshitta NT published by the Way Intl. I do not recomend the translation, however the interliniar is helpful. The best translation
of the Peshitta NT available is that of James Murdock. (Until my version is published)

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/aramntsch242.htmlSteven's example of Trimm's backpedaling
: Schmuel Sat Aug 9, 2003 [AramaicNT] I do not recomend the translation (AEINT)
JAMES now, about the AEINT (above)
"not familiar"
"not having seen"
"had not seen"
JAMES before
"am aware"
"the interliniar is helpful"
AND compares the translation to that of Murdock, unfavorably.

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/aramnttrimm243.html
Trimm's bold lie
James Trimm Sat Aug 9, 2003 Re: I do not recomend the translation (AEINT)

These were posts that embarrassed James Trimm by exposing his public history. The pseudo-translastion modification of existing text was already known, while these posts helped unravel James’ denials about the AEINT.

Please keep in mind that the plagiarism however does not need any of this historical confirmation, it is proven simply by the next section, the side-by-side comparison.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SAMPLES AND SIDE-BY-SIDE - THE PLAGIARISM PROOFhttp://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/hrvtitlepg.jpgTrimm's HRV title page stating he translated Ancient Hebrew and Aramaic manuscripts."translated by James S. Trimm"
"taken from ancient Hebrew and Aramaic manuscripts"http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/titlepageway.jpgWay International title page and copyrightThe Way translation (Aramaic-English Interlinear New Testatment) was produced in 1988

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/samplepgway.jpgSample page of Way translation- Mark 1-28:40 (note Aramaic at the right)

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/hrvmark1.jpgSample page of HRV Mark 1 Verses 1-14

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/hrvtitlepg.jpgTrimm's HRV title page stating he translated ancient Hebrew and Aramaic manuscripts"Translated by James S. Trimm".
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SIDE-BY-SIDE
All Readers Are Strongly Encouraged to Actually Review these Two Section Showing the HRV and the AEINT Side-by-Sidehttp://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/mark.htmMark 1-4 HRV and AEINT side-by-side, four chapters

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/luke.htmLuke 1 HRV and AEINT - side-by-side, one chapter

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

10 MINUTE CHALLENGE

This plagiarism is so blatant that it does not require any special Semitic language savvy, any sophisticated knowledge of English grammar or vocabulary, or any deep mathematical probability analysis to be fully seen, reviewd and clearly comprehended.

Simply carefully look at the two translations side by side, and note the almost absolute agreement on ..

Noun and verb and adjective vocabulary choice
Conjunction and preposition and articles
English word order
Punctuation, including each comma and period.

This goes on, not just for a few verses, but
Verse after verse
Chapter after chapter
Book after book.

The blatant nature of the plagiarism shows up even in copying
Grammatical errors
Strange, convoluted grammatical structures.
Anomolies

     You will never find any two translations that agree in this way, unless .....
One translation is using the other as a base text.

=============================================
MESSIANIC_APOLOGETIC ARCHIVE

     We are including below perhaps the most significant URL's that discussed the HRV-AEINT connection. James' contentions were switching, and we document the absurdity of his original "exact matrix" and "methodology" contentions, and contrast his later fallback comments.

THE DIALOG

    We helped bring this plagiarism to the fore on the Messianic_Apologetic email forum. Mostly, we simply added a little statistical count of variants to the side-by-side comparison.

The first two posts give an overview, especially 5071, which has a number of url's, then we give the posts that have James' responses. The first post is largely my (Schmuel) moderator note, the second is an early analysis, similar to this one you are reading, although much shorter.7/07/03 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5055Mon Jul 7, 2003 Subject: plagarized translation? - James Trimm HRV This post is an early review of many of the issues.
We note here the discussion of The Complete Jewish Bible

COMPARISON WITH DAVID STERN IN TRANSLATION
Schmuel - "And let me offer a comparison. David Stern's translation we have spoken somewhat negatively about here, and we don't recommend it for use. However when David added the Tanach, David was painfully honest in the Preface, stating that he had simply taken the JPS-1917 (which was off-copyright) and updated the English, and that his Hebrew is grade-school level."

     In other words, David Stern used another translation as a base underlying text, exactly like James Trimm. However, David acknowledged his usage of the JPS-1917, and did not claim that he was producing an original translation, which was the prime deception used by James Trimm to promote the HRV-NT. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5071
Schmuel Wed Jul 9, 2003 [Messianic_Apologetic] In my Defense ? - James Trimm offers no response to the plagiarism documentation2 Corinthians 4:1-2
Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not; But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

2 Corinthians 2:17
For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God:
but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.----------------------------------------
     Clearly this plagiarism is a very important issue today, even a plague upon our Messianic brethren.   James has desperately tried to maintain some level of (Internet) 'scholarship' acceptance as well, for what is essentially simply a scam. Many people have paid for single and multiple copies of this HRV translation, even in advance, some even investing hundreds of dollars, some adding additional donations, thinking this "original translation" will be an aide to their fellowships. Today, among those who have studied the plagarism evidence, some are disillusioned, some are angry, some considered it simply a learning experience. Yet today many are not fully aware of the extent of the scam.

     Many have been shocked to see the ongoing request for further donations to help in publication of SANJ materials, additional donation requests by James for a book that was supposed to be ready a year of so back..

     To many of us, more important than the money, is the realization that these theories of the Scripture text (17) have been combined with a pricey unethical plagiarism. Simply "playing with ones head" about the Word of God, for filthy lucre.

    It is our desire here to help bring clarity to what has occurred. We also hope that by bringing forth this history, we will hear forthright, strong statements of denunciation from the leaders of the Messianic and Aramaic and scholarship communities, many of whom have appeared simply befuddled and confused, and far too willing to tolerate this elaborate textual scam.1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened.

     Doctrinal issues can be fluid and subjective, yet Integrity issues are really foundational. Poor doctrine often foments integrity difficulties, and visa versa, but one cannot fully weigh integrity by doctrine, or doctrine by integrity. One man's revelation is anothers heresy, but plagiarism for status and lucre is simply unethical.

     As indicated earlier, the source that was used as the base text in the HRV is the Aramaic-English Interlinear New Testament by the Way International. (American Christian Press - New Knoxville, Ohio).. - we will call it the AEINT.

http://www.empirenet.com/~messiah7/rvw_aramaic.htmAramaic Publications by The Way International - - this article by John P. Juedes gives some background information on the Way publications.

JAMES' RESPONSES

These are James' posts, part of a dialog on Messainic_Apologetic where he originally tried to claim that the word-for-word, punctuation-for-punctuation agreement between the HRV and the AEINT was simply coincidental, based on using the same "translation methodologies". Anyone who looks at the text and understands even a little bit about English and probability sees how absurd was this original contention from James. Later, as the history information came out, James started to acknowledge his "familiarity" with the AEINT.

James tried the trick of claiming that the sections were cherry-picked. Actually it turned out that other sections were just as clear HRV-AEINT copying, and that, as those of you who know a little probability, the amazing confluence is simply absolute proof of the plagiarism

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5074
From: James Trimm Date: Wed Jul 9, 2003
Subject: Re: In my Defense ? - James Trimm offers no response to the plagiarism documentation "petty dispute"
"Now realize that the accuser has searched for the most similar sections they could find"

Kathryn responded to the false accusation here, refuting the false accusastion of convenience.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5270
Date: Sun Jul 27, 2003 Subject: Was Mark really the most similar HRV section?
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5097
"James Trimm" Jul 10, 2003 Subject: My Aramaic Studies"THIS CONCORDANCE served as the EXACT TRANSLATION matrix for the later WAY translation. It also served as MY VOCABULARY GUIDE when I learned Aramaic. In other words THEIR translation matrix was my LEARNED VOCABULARY."

This is based on the absolute myth that two translators would EVER have the exact same series of sentences... prepositions, conjunctions and commas and word order and errors and anomalies, as well as noun and verb vocabulary choices, simply because they studied from the same book. Many of these choices are not even a function of the source language, they are only a function of one's target language style, which varies from person to person.

The nonsense of this claim can even be seen in a single sentence, although the copying goes on by James verse after verse, chapter after chapter.

Here is the very first sentence of the King James Bible book of Luke.

King James Bible

1 Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,

2 Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;

3 It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,

4 That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

And here is the same sentence in the beginning of the AEINT.

1 Because many have decided to write the accounts of the deeds of which we are persuaded,

2 as that which they delivered to us, those who were previously eyewitnesses and ministers of the word,

3 it seemed good also to me, because I had carefully attended to all of them, that I should write down everything in order for you, noble Theophilus,

4 that you might know the truth of the words that you have been taught.

There are truly a myriad of word order, vocabulary and preposition, conjunction and article decisions and potential variants in just one sentence, as well as punctuation. Many of these cannot be dictated by the Aramaic using ANY methodology, as Aramaic handles these issues very differently. A good translator must make all sorts of decisions, and on a complicated sentence..

Yet the HRV translates virtually every word identical, even the basic awkward construct of using “because” twice in the same sentence. “Eyewitnesses” is changed to “shammashim”, as that is part of the Hebraization matrix, James then capitalizes “Word” and changes “as” to “like”. Every other word is identical. Not just similar, not just close, but identical.

Let us return to the Messianic_Apologetic dialog.

Note that at this point James would not acknowledge that he actually had the AEINT itself !
The Concordance above being referred to is NOT the AEINT, but an publication work by The Way International. So James simply created a "cover story" to try to explain the similarity, pretending, at this time, that he did not have the AEINT.

James refuted his own charade later (below), when proof came out that he had the AEINT."Moreover a translator cannot avoid being influenced by other translations with which he is familiar."- James Trimm

When I asked James whether he had the AEINT.. note the confused, unhelpful response.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5107
Schmuel Fri Jul 11, 2003 HRV Luke, John, Mark, Acts - from Old Syriac or Peshitta ? 2) Did you have the actual Way translation of the NT (not just the concordance) available when you produced the HRV ? Your long discussion of using the concordance, etc bypassed answering this simple question.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5109
James Trimm" Fri Jul 11, 2003 Re: HRV Luke, John, Mark, Acts - from Old Syriac or Peshitta ?2. I have explained the origin of the similar translation matrix between the HRV and the Way edition via the Way Concordance that I learned Aramaic with. Apart from that I detect a witch hunt. WHat
difference does it make when I auired the Way translation? If I happened to have owned the Way translation before the HRV was published wouth that "prove" something or only give you amunition to
continue falsey accusing me?First, note the horrific spelling and faulty grammar...
Then, finally, the first defacto almost acknowledgment.
"If I happened to have owned the Way translation before the HRV was published"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
James next idea was that showing the areas of change from the AEINT would be an answer to the proven base text usage of the AEINT. This is absurd, as James had simply modified the AEINT text in two manners...
1) The obvious matrix above.. Hebraizations, Nazarenazations, etc.
2) His earlier notes and OS updates that he corralled from various Semitic-text oriented sources.
We discuss more the Old Syriac, and other adjustments to the AIENT text, in Footnote (16)

Well, ok, he also made a very minor change here and there, like “as” to “like” above.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5173
Jul 19, 2003 5:17 am Subject: Aramaic HRV Source (part 1)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5172
James Trimm Sat Jul 19, 2003 5:20 am Subject: Aramaic HRV Source (part 2) More passages where the HRV and Way versions differ in such a way that:
1) the meaning of the passage is greatly affected and
2) the difference could only be the result of the direct dependence of the HRV translation on the Aramaic of the Old Syriac and/or Peshitta.See Footnote (16). Again, the idea that a specified modification to a base text shows a "dependence" on another text is simply absurd.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5189
"James Trimm" Mon Jul 21, 2003 Re: The base underlying text of the HRV is the AEINT - #1Your comparison is fundamentally flawed. The HRV are both (sic) literal translations of the Aramaic.Note that James is returning to his reliance on the "Concordance", despite the fact that he has defacto acknowledged the actual AEINT in his possession. Later he admits the obvious when he says, in regard to the AEINT..

"Moreover a translator cannot avoid being influenced by other translations with which he is familiar."- James Trimm
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5194

James Trimm Jul 21, 2003 Subject: HRV source

The second fault is that it can easily be shown that the source of the HRV cannot be the Way English version because:
1. The HRV translates Aramaic words which the Way translator did not translate and include. For example in Mark 1:13 the HRV translates the Aramaic word KAD as "while" (i.e. "while being tempted") while the Way version ignores the word and simply renders "being tempted". The HRV
cannot plagiarize words that are not there.
The ability to obfuscate by pointing out a twig instead of a forest is one of James' skill. Clearly James made some updates to the AEINT text, based on his earlier studies of various Semitic text authors. See Footnote (16). To point out these specified adjustments, covered in his earlier writings, creating changes here without attributions, as somehow changing the overwhelming base text agreement, is simply nonsense.

Around this time James left the Messianic_Apologetic forum, when the hard specific verse questions were being asked, by folks like Craig and Sidney and Moshe and myself. Questions such as the HRV even having the exact same English grammatical errors and awkward English constructions and anomalies as the AEINT. Questions that are a little hard to obfuscate and avoid. Mostly James was relying on the laziness or lack of time, that most observers would not actually look at the two texts side-by-side. In fact,

our experience is that most folks do not even take the time to do their own comparison. Ergo, any "spin" story might fly.

     James then set up his own forum, "Messianic_Apologetics":-) Kathryn humorously mentions this might be "Forum Plagiarism" :-), copying our name and adding an “s”. We did consider it an honor, a compliment that our forum was so good that James left in a huff and copied our name, and began his next propaganda blitz. Around this time, Moshe Koniuchowsky of YATI also became involved in therailing accusations. (18)

     On James' forums he has not let in any specific difficult questions about the HRV, such as the shared grammatical errors (below), or a simple translational test and/or mathematical analysis. Or encouraging people simply to look at the two texts side-by-side. James has clamped down, to a tight control, so his own power base, the Nazarene email forums, will not know much about the HRV plagiarism.

=======================================================
CONTINUING FROM THE MESSIANIC_APOLOGETIC DIALOG

    To demonstrate the huge variation between translations that are done independently, we took three verses (and one other in graph) and compared all the available Aramaic to English translations.

(You can do similarly from the Greek or Hebrew/Aramaic by comparing ANY English translations of Scripture that are done independently.)

-------------------------------7/21 ANALYSIS OF FIVE TRANSLATIONS (EXTRACTS FROM POST)http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5180
Schmuel Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:28 am The base underlying text of the HRV is the AEINT - #1Does the HRV (James Trimm) text..

e.g Mark 1 1 The beginning of the good news of Yeshua, the Messiah, the son of Eloah.
2 As it is written in Yesha`yahu the prophet, Behold, I will send my messenger before your face that he might prepare your way,
3 A voice which cries in the wilderness, Prepare the way of YHWH and make straight his paths.

Use the The Way International (AEINT) as a base text for most books?
- only modifying verses under specified, distinct criteria.

1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus the Messiah, the son of God.
2 As it is written in Isaiah the prophet, Behold, I will send my messenger before your face that he might prepare your way,
3 a voice which cries in the wilderness, Prepare the way of the lord and make straight his paths.

There are many decisions of word order, usage, conjunctions, prepositions,
punctuation, etc that are based on fluid, individual factors, such as the

Translators -
English style
English grammar (many multiple usages are equivalent)
Abundant choice of English vocabulary, one word in a source language
can have multiple corresponding English words. Translators will differ on these choices.
Even punctuation varies, as the target language has numerous features not in the source language.

========================================================
TRANSLATION ANALYSIS
Five translations from the Aramaic, (King James Bible added below)Hebraic-Roots Version "New Testament" - James S. Trimm

Aramaic-English Interlinear New Testament - The Way International Research Team

Murdoch http://www.peshitta.com/jamesmurdock/books/mark.html
THE SYRIAC PESHITO VERSION. THE NEW TESTAMENT; OR, THE BOOK OF THE HOLY GOSPEL OF OUR LORD AND OUR GOD, JESUS THE MESSIAH.
A Literal Translation from the Syriac Peshito Version. BY JAMES MURDOCK, D.D.

Etheridge http://www.peshitta.com/johnwesleyetheridge/books/markos.html
PESCHITO SYRIAC NEW TESTAMENT: TRANSLATED BY JOHN WESLEY ETHERIDGE.

HOLY BIBLE From Ancient Eastern Manuscripts - George Lamsa (20)============================================================
First, I want you look at a basic example that shows more graphically the large number of technical translational differences than can exist in just one verse, even in very similar translations.Way
6 Now John was clothed with a garment of the hair of camels and was bound [with] leather around his loins, and his food was locusts and honey from the wild.

Trimm-HRV
6 Now Yochanan was clothed with garment of the hair of camels and was bound [with] leather around his loins, and his food was locusts and wild honey.

Murdoch
6 And this John was clad in raiment of camels' hair; and was girded with a cincture of skin about his loins; and his food was locusts and wild honey.

Etheridge
6. John wore clothes made from camel hair and tied a leather belt on his back, and his food was the grasshoppers and honey of the wilderness.

Lamsa
John wore a dress of camel's hair, with a girdle of leather fastened around his loins; and his food was locusts and wild honey.

Trimm/Way Murdoch Etheridge LamsaNow And this (nothing) (nothing)
(John/Yochanan)
was clothed was clad wore clothes wore
with/with a in made from a
garment raiment (nothing) dress
of the hair of camels of camel's hair from camel hair of camel's hair
and was bound and was girded and tied with a girdle
(with) with of
leather a cinture of skin a leather belt leather fastened
around his loins about his loins on his back around his loins
(and his food was)
(locusts and) grasshoppers and
wild honey wild honey and honey of the wilderness wild honey
(Way- and honey from the wild)--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We can see 12 variants here, in one verse (one punctuation variant excluded).

The only Way/HRV difference is "with" vs "with a",
(note: even the unusual special usage for insertions-- [with] -- equivalent to italics - is done identically.)

All the other translations have about 10 variants, in one verse,

VERY IMPORTANT NOTE
EVERY two translations have about 10 variants from EVERY other translation.EXCEPT the HRV and the AEINT.

THIS IS THE BASIC ISSUE, and it goes on verse after verse.
So this graph above is an example of many of the nuances of translations.
Conjunction, prepositions, tenses, articles and various nouns and verbs are rendered differently, even in very close translations.

=========================================
NOTE: We then analyzed the three verses from the beginning of Mark in depthMark 1
1 The beginning of the good news of Yeshua, the Messiah, the son of Eloah.
2 As it is written in Yesha`yahu the prophet, Behold, I will send my messenger before your face that he might prepare your way,
3 A voice which cries in the wilderness, Prepare the way of YHWH and make straight his paths.

Word by word, variant by variant (see the url, #5180) leading to this summary..
============================================
SUMMARY
3 Verses - analyzed for five quite close translations, all rather close, all on the "literal" side.

21 total variants, showing how the HRV compares with the other four translations
(omitting the Hebraicisms and Nazarenisms which are unique to Trimm)

Compared to the HRV.

15 variants- Murdoch
15 - Etherige
12 - Llamsa
1 - Way (capital "A "- the WordProcessor/stylistic capitalization of the beginning of the verse)

Many of the variants are simply English punctuation,
NOTE: commas and capitalizations are EIGHT of the variants, features that are simply absent from Aramaic, and could not be compelled by any translation matrix.

AND the HRV and AEINT also agree on unusual usages such as "son of God/Eloah" or "Yeshua/Jesus, the Messiah"

(Also the other variants are generally stylistic English vocabulary and grammar choices)

The claim that these this confluence is from the Aramaic should simply be discarded,
(this goes on verse after verse after verse).
This is only possible if the Way is used as a base text.

==================================================================
THE HRV ALSO KEEPS ERRORS AND ANOMALIES FROM THE AEINTIn addition to the overall analysis above, we then went to the verses where
there are simply grammatical errors, or anomalies, or very strange constructions,
to show that even these were copied directly from the AEINT to the HRV.

From http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/mark.htm
Mark 1-4 HRV-AEINT side-by-side
Examples of very unusual readings that can not
be remotely attributed to translation methodology.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5201
Schmuel Tue Jul 22, 2003 [Messianic_Apologetic] HRV source.... English grammatical error that you share with the AEINT
Verse 7 "more powerful than me" rather than
"more powerful than I" the Murdock reading ?

... strange placing of the comma that you share with the AEINT
Verse 1 "Yeshua, the Messiah" rather than
. "Yeshua the Messiah" as you do in other translations or even in the same section
. "Yeshua the Natzrati"

... small "s" in spirit and "son" that both you and AEINT follow.
Verse 10 "and the spirit, like a dove"
. 11 "Thou art my beloved son"
-----------------------
Also we would add the first sentence, four verses, of Luke as a good example of a very strange, convoluted grammatical structure, brought over word for word from the AEINT to the HRV

Luke 1
1 Because many have decided to write the accounts of the deeds of which we are persuaded,
2 like that which they delivered to us, those who were previously eyewitnesses and shammashim of the Word,
3 it seemed good also to me, because I had carefully attended to all of them, that I should write down everything in order for you, noble Theophilus,
4 that you might know the truth of the words that you have been taught.

This 'double-because' sentence, starting the verse and book with a 'because' combined with a second 'because' in the same sentence, is simply very poor English.

You could put this to 100 translators, and it is would be very unlikely for even one to match even that one aspect of this sentence in their English target source, and they would have a huge number of variants over the four verses.

In contrast, the HRV matches the AEINT, not just in the absurdly awkward construction, but every comma, preposition, vocabulary choice and word order.

And this goes on and on.

=====================================================================
We also reviewed more, and discussed English variations, at ..http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5279Mon Jul 21, 2003 The base underlying text of the HRV is the AEINT - #2First note below that James' main contention and examples does NOT address whether the AEINT
is a base text. It is simply showing specific places where the HRV and AEINT differ, and this is a completely different issue ..

DO THE MATH :-)You can multiply some of these by about 1,000, others by 10,000 and more to start doing some probability analysis?.. You can start calculating the possibility that the HRV text did not simply use the AEINT as a base. Hopefully some are familiar with probability calculations :-)

Here are some of the translator choices that will vary in any two translations.OTHER ISSUES
capitalizations
punctuation (commas, periods, colons, etc)
singular and plural (eg . Mark 1:11 heavens) (thank you, Sidney)
brackets (used like italics-inserted words)
every noun, verb, adjective vocabulary choice.
every preposition, conjunction, article,
word order
even unusual idiosyncrasies ("son of God", "Yeshua, the Messiah")Our view is that James has made an absurd contention.

In addition, no one can ever show two translations that have anything remotely close to this degree of similarity, unless one was dependent on another as a base text...........

In fact, it is rare to find two translations having an identical single set of even three VERSES.

And in the HRV-AEINT the confluence is not one verse, it is
verse after verse,
chapter after chapter,
book after book
================================================
And as we exposed this plagiarism, things got curiouser and curiouser.
=============================================

SHIFTING STORY#1 - WE FIND JAMES' ACTUAL VIEW OF THE TRANSLATION HE FOLLOWS"I do not recomend the translation"
- James Trimm of the AEINT translationhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5321
Schmuel Fri Aug 1, 2003 [Messianic_Apologetic] I do not recomend the translationAnd yet James also compliments the AEINT by the Way International as being "literal" like his version.
Now, since they agree word-for-word, punctuation-for-punctuation, error for error, anomaly for anomaly - verse after verse, chapter after chapter, book after book It is not too surprising that James must now speak rather favorably of the AEINT --
Here is how James spoke of the AEINT before -- emphasis added, spelling as written.

==========================================================James Trimm - via ParaNet node 1:104/422 UUCP)
Subject: New Testament In Aramaic Newsgroups: alt.messianic Date: 1993-12-

Yes I am aware of the edition you mention, which is an interliniar of the Peshitta NT published by the Way Intl. I do not recomend the translation, however the interliniar is helpful. The best translation
of the Peshitta NT available is that of James Murdock. (Until my version is published).====================
Yet James' own "version" today agrees most everywhere, precisely to a "T",with the same translation he does "not recomend" ..

===========================================================

SHIFTING STORY#2 - WE FIND WHERE JAMES GOT THE IDEA OF USING THE AEINT
- JAMES "STOLE" THE IDEA OF PLAGIARISING (BASED ON HIS OWN ACCUSATIONS)

" Jahn had obtained the Way Intl. Interlinear edition and
decided he could use that to produce his version" - James TrimmTEXTCRIT FORUM - 1998 - George Kiraz is a noted Syriac scholar. (emphasis added)http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tc-list/message/4543
From: "George Kiraz" Date: Sat Sep 12, 1998 Subject: tc-list Syriac NT translation
Author: Herb Jahn
Title: The Aramaic New Covenant
Description: "This rendering of the New Testament by Herb Jahn claims to be the only literal translation/transliteration made from the original Aramaic, the variant of the Hebrew language spoken by Jesus and His disciples." ISBN: 0963195166

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tc-list/message/4545
From: James Trimm Date: Sat Sep 12, 1998 Subject: Re: tc-list Syriac NT translationYes I know all about it. Originally Mr. Jahn hired me to do the translation. We signed the contracts and all went well for about three months. Three months into the nine month project Jahn violated our
contract and quit paying me (although I had kept my end of the contract). It seems that Jahn had obtained the Way Intl. Interlinear edition and decided he could use that to produce his version.Jahn himself does not know a word of Aramaic. (snip) Footnote (19) (Herb Jahn)For historical completeness, we discovered this "smoking cannon" after the following dialog.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5323"truthseeker3712" Date: Fri Aug 1, 2003 Subject: Re: I do not recomend the translation http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5325 Schmuel Date: Fri Aug 1, 2003 Subject: [Messianic_Apologetic] Exegeses Bible

==================================================================

SHIFTING STORY#3 - James abandons the cover story and acknowledges he is
'familiar' with and 'influenced by' the AIENT

http://www.christianforums.com/PDA/index.php/t-66435"Moreover a translator cannot avoid being influenced by other
translations with which he is familiar."- James Trimm todayFirst we discussed this new admission on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5381
Schmuel Thu Aug 7, 2003 A translator cannot avoid being influenced by other translations

Then, Sidney Davis hit the nail on the head, in a question never answered,
Meanwhile, James left the forum and set up his own controlled playground "Messianic_Apologetics"

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5383
sabbathmorefully Date: Thu Aug 7, 2003 Subject: the HRV NTSidney = “You state above, "Moreover a translator cannot avoid being influenced by other translations with which he is familiar." Is this a veiled admission that you were both influenced and/or familiar with "The Way" version/translation before or while you were translating your HRV? The fact that you "cannot avoid being influenced by other translations with which [you are] familiar" and that this obtained with your being influenced and being familiar with "The Way" translation/version is the very observation and point being raised on the original Messianic Apolegetic forum and which observations you have characterized as slander and "lashon hara" and not only that, but have extended this characterization to those who have examined the evidence and have been led to question the same. -- See also Footnote(20) on "Lashon Hara"--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------JAMES FAILED ATTEMPT TO FIND COMPARABLE VERSE SIMILARITIES

http://www.christianforums.com/PDA/index.php/t-66435James offered a public analysis trying to show similarity of versions comparable to the HRV-AEINT.
The problem is that it fails completely.

Watch the claim, we would call it a lie, but we doubt that James actually did any careful checking or counting. James apparently does not know the difference between general similarlity and having almost no variants of any kind (vocabularly, punctuation, prepositions, word order, etc.)James Trimm -"This comparison shows clearly that very literal translations will tend to agree closely with each other. Obviously the KJV and NKJV should not be compared directly to each other, they have both been given so that the other translations could be easily and quickly compared to each of them. The HRV has no greater agreement with other literal translations from the Aramaic than these literal translations from the Greek have with each other (and probably less).

Let's even take his King James Bible and NKJV analysis, just to make it harder.

KJV 1: The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

NKJV: The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

KJV 2: As it is written in the prophets,

NKJV 2: As it is written in the Prophets:

KJV Behold, I send my messenger before thy face,

NKJV "Behold, I send My messenger before Your face,

KJV which shall prepare thy way before thee.

NKJV Who will prepare Your way before You."

KJV 3: The voice of one crying in the wilderness,

NKJV 3: "The voice of one crying in the wilderness:

KJV Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

NKJV: 'Prepare the way of the LORD; Make His paths straight.' "

KJV 4: John did baptize in the wilderness,

NKJV 4: John came baptizing in the wilderness

KJV: and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

NKJV: and preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

KJV 5: And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem,

NKJV 5: Then all the land of Judea, and those from Jerusalem, went out to him

Now, of course these look similar, yet…. look closely, and you will see that, for the five chosen verse, there are approximately ……
30 TRANSLATION VARIANTS BETWEEN THE KING JAMES BIBLE AND THE NKJV

To help you see this, I will take one of the nine lines.

KJV Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

NKJV: 'Prepare the way of the LORD; Make His paths straight.' "

KJV NKJV

Quote mark (the Messenger speaking

Lord LORD

Comma semi-colon

make Make

Double-Quote (the Prophets speaking)

Look, in ONE PART OF ONE VERSE, chosen by James, looking almost identical, SIX VARIANTS

This is a PERFECT example of variants in translation. And please NOTE that none of these variants would be dictated by any translation methodology.

Thank you, James for a perfect example. THIRTY VARIANTS overall in your identical section.

    By contrast, looking at the AEINT and HRV there are only 3 three changes that are not the simple result of James' translation matrix above (Hebraizations, etc.). With a little research we could probably peg even those minor changes to his taking ideas from other Semitic sources as in Footnote (16).

    So the very example chosen by James PROVES the vast difference that any two independent
translations will have. James did virtually no changes to the AEINT other than the obvious matrix and the small sections where he substituted from an OS source.

     So, James forgot to actually count the King James Bible/NKJV variances in a manner like we did above. Or thought he could snow the readers. Have a little fun and catch the approximately 30 variants. It is a perfect example, even on a pretty easy section of text, of exactly the HUGE number of variants that any two even independent translations will have, even when closely aligned. Some of the texts of course have far more variants with each other than the 30.

============================================================
ADDITIONAL STUDIES - CRAWFORD REVELATIONShttp://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/TruthandTrimm2.PDFTruth and Trimm - 12 pages - Crawford Revelation is the focusAndrew Gabriel Roth disassembles James' claims to try to make this Crawford Revelation some sort of early special manuscript, or related to the Old Syriac. An interesting side-issue of Trimm at work.
=============================================================

OTHER MESSIANIC_APOLOGETIC DISCUSSIONSIn the Messianic_Apologetic archives you can find see many spin-off discussions. Dealing with this plagiarism really helpforced us to become sharper and more sensitive on a number of issues.

Integrity - is it first.. or down at the bottom of our concerns after our pet doctrines
Watchmen - our responsibilities to our brethren
Lashon hara - definition, truth and falsehood, safeguards, appropriateness
Beit Din - definition, function, authority
Textual Theories - Received Text, Old Syriac, Middle Ages Matthew
Textual Criticism - basic paradigmic understanding
Accreditation - seminary and private and government accreditation
Diploma Cottage-Industries - the history in Messianic circles
Two Witnesses - An attempt to use James' wife and webmaster as the witnesses
Jewish Conversions - and Messianics raised Gentile calling themselves 'Jewish'
Hebrew Roots - the various critiques and issues, such as kabbalah
Tetragrammaton - how pronounced, textual preservation, and Masoretic vowels
Aramaic/English translation - including incomplete discussion with James and Moshe Shulman
KJB and Geneva Bible - the Geneva Study Bible is the KJB text
Soap Operas - Christians views thereof

===========================================================
One item should be mentioned here .. from our poster Nancy..
============================================================
REFUND REQUESTS - UNANSWEREDhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5134

nanasarshalom Jul 13, 2003 Subject: A requestNancy
"I would also like at this time to request that you refund my money for the HRV and the Commentary also. I will be happy to return them to you in their barely used condition.”

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5157

nanasarshalom Jul 16, 2003 Subject: re: due process

“In fact, James, and every other teacher/leader have used forums to promote and sell their wares as packaged truth and guaranteed as such. If one chooses this venue to offer their particular brand of truth then doesn't accountability also lie with the framework of the same venue? The obvious issue is a simple one - a refund based on a misrepresentation of the facts. Those who profess to adhere to a Torah observant lifestyle, as well as being a "teacher" of Torah, should they not also be judged by the same standard? .....Isn't responsibility to act nobly and within the constructs of godly behavior required of those who choose to sell their wares under the auspices of walking and living righteously? If so, then repentance is called for when one chooses to act irresponsibly toward a brother or sister in Messiah.”Two other posts from Nancy especially also speak to our hearts on this matter.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5310

nanasarshalom Jul 30, 2003 Subject: The Standard of Righteousness

1 Cor 5

2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that did this deed might be taken from your midst. 3 For as being absent in body, but being present in spirit, I have already judged the one who has worked out this thing, as if I were present: 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, you being gathered together with my spirit also, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 to deliver such a one to Satan for destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. 6 Your boast is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens all the lump? 7 *****Then purge out the old leaven so that you may be a new lump, even as you are unleavened. *****

In other words, separate yourself from them, have nothing to do with them, do not listen to them, ignore them, disfellowship yourself from them --- what fellowship does darkness have with light?

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5324

nanasarshalom Fri Aug 1, 2003 Subject: re: Higher Truth

In my study over many years I have heard clever sayings like "eat the fish and spit out the bones". I have witnessed many who were convinced that they could do this, but in the end, the bones got caught in their throats. By this I mean that I have witnessed people who played with "teachings" that that led them into doubt about who the Messiah really was, about the validity and inspiration of the scriptures, and the next thing you know, they were practicing Rabbinic Judaism. I have learned that there are many false prophets and false teachers in this "roots" movement. They are more concerned about building a financial kingdom, than they are about peoples spiritual well being and eternal destiny.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EMAIL FORUM RESOURCES FOR DISCUSSION AND ANALYSIS
In general the forum that I moderate

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic

Subscribe: Messianic_Apologetic-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

“Is Yeshua(Jesus) the Messiah of the Tenach (Old Testament) ? Dialog on the traditional rabbinical viewpoints, prophetic fulfillment, typology, and similar questions on all sides of these issues. Moderated to only allow respectful dialog. We try to stay on-topic focused and avoid flooding the poor AOL'ers mailboxes. Expect to give proper scriptural and scholarly citation and quotes for your assertions. If you are a know-it-all, find another list :-)”

Has historically been the venue with most discussions, and concern, for these Integrity issues.

It has been a privilege to have so many posters and friends concerned about the Integrity

of the Scriptures, and their Inspiration, Preservation, and Authority.

-------------------------

Recently a new forum has opened up on Yahoogroups called the… nazarene_fraud_victims/http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nazarene_fraud_victims/Subscribe: nazarene_fraud_victims-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

Now, on this forum the emphasis is varied, often on issues like not receiving merchandise, “customer disservice” and various promises and representations made by SANJ-Trimm. However, they are also discussing in detail the integrity issues, including what is likely the most important, the plagiarism of the Scriptures.

If folks want to discuss the technical aspects of the plagiarism, there is a forum I have opened in reserve

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hebraic-Roots-Version/ Subscribe: Hebraic-Roots-Version-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

“The Hebraic-Roots-Version New Testament by James Trimm came out in 2003. There is compelling evidence that it is not an original translation, as claimed, but uses the Aramaic-English Interlinear New Testament by the Way International. As James Trimm has a large presence on the Internet through email forums and web site, this requires Messianics and Nazarenes in particular to examine the ethical issues and act righteously.”
================================================================
CONCLUSION
We feel it would be wonderful if James Trimm would have a true repentance, and then acknowledge the truth of the HRV-AEINT base text plagiarism. And then offer proper refunds to all who might request, especially those who purchased the HRV because they expected an original translation, as represented. The HRV-NT text could be withdrawn from the market, or at least the title page and all promotion clearly and properly and prominently changed to reflect the true source of the text. A sincere, no-nonsense, direct apology to the Messianic and Aramaic communities for this travesty would be absolutely vital. Attempt to make it history, and then move on in Messiah.

However, we did not write all this for James Trimm. We wrote this article in the role of a watchman, to be of assistance to our brothers and sisters. That is our most pleasant and reasonable responsibility before Yeshua. In regard to James, there is, unfortunately a well-established pattern. Yes, it is our hope and prayer that the pattern will be broken.

Yet, for our brothers and sisters, the need is today. We must discern truth from lies, we must not spend our precious resources supporting works of iniquity, and we should not seek to use a “bible version” tainted with the greed and deception of the HRV.

We have patiently and joyfully (yes, there is joy in doing labors for Messiah, even if they are about unsavory situations) gathered the evidence together, and present it to those who do not yet have access.

Though it has taken some time and effort, it has been a labour of love. And all such labours bring forth peaceable fruits. We often forget how the Scriptures look upon such labours.

1Thessalonians 1:3

Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love,

and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father;

Hebrews 6:10

For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.

Lord, I ask you that this work, which have given me the privilege of defending your Holy Scriptures against the spirits of lucre and deception, will be acceptable in your site. In the Name of Yeshua haMashiach, the Lord Jesus Christ.

There may be no greater abomination than deception involving the Word of God for $ and status.
Such can not be approved.1 Peter 5:2
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof,
not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

Shalom,
Steven Avery
Queens, NY

Schmuel@bigfoot.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/

=======================================================================
FOOTNOTES(1) SANJ The main SANJ domain is www.nazarene.net , others like www.hebraicrootsversion.com are James Trimm publicity, in this case promoting the HRV. James owns and moderates a number of Yahoogroups forums, and even sets up threads on other web forums such as www.christianforums.com . As moderator on these forums, James will either prevent or remove posts that clearly spell out all the integrity issues, leaving only his canned response, such as a pointer to his webiste. On more neutral forums, (especially various Messianic forums on Yahoogroups) James pushes his publicity, and then cries "lashon hara" and "slander" to the list owner the moment the real issues are shared. Often the list owners, not desiring controversy, yield to the blandishments and fiegned outrage from James, or one of his supporters.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------(2) Agreements with James TrimmNot that long ago James and I confronted the "lunar sabbath" deception in Paltalk voice chat, and earlier were involved in discussions about the Messianic prophecies in Isaiah. On the email forums I would reprint his Psalm 22 (pierced/like a lion) discussion, although I would note a dearth of proper attribution by James, some questionable scholarship, and an unresponsiveness to additions or corrections. Some of his material, nonetheless, would be helpful. I would always have to be very careful on any of his scholarship, and lack of attribution, but a few of his articles I felt were helpful.

James follows my lead on Dan Chaput.About even one year before James publicly confronted Dan Chaput at the Sacred Name Unity conference in Holt, Michigan, on his Nazarene forums I publicly pointed out the problems in regard to "Dan Israel" and his Christian Identity perspective. A woman named Beverly McLamb helped corral the materials, and we began contacting ISR, and especially Wilhelm Wolfaardt, asking why Dan was the USA distributor for ISR Bibles (In response, they shortly did add on other distributors.).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3) Email Forums

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4) SANJ Doctrines

The various SANJ doctrinal views are not the issue here, as we are focusing on the Scripture text plagiarism. We could go around and around on doctrine, and folks would have various views. However, here are a couple of notes SANJ doctrines.

They have propagated error major with the kabbalistic Messiahology views, including the idea of "Two YHWH’s”. Our friends Mikhail and Sharra are preparing a paper on the latter. James has even at times propounded an “oral law from Sinai”, but one that is corrupt. Talk about confusion. On a more positive side, SANJ has affirmed, in a general sense, the canon of the NT and the virgin birth of Messiah. Overriding all this, however, SANJ has combined a very confused idea of the Scripture text, with its promotion of the textual plagiarisms. That will remain our principle focus.

We will defer on some of the other discussions about whether the Nazarene organization is cultish, especially as discussed on Kathryn's website. The issue can be considered mute, as the plagiarism issue alone should mark SANJ , as a group that simply needs to be first exposed and called to repentance.

As to the doctrinal issues, we cannot however go onto SANJ forums and debate these issues, not with the plagiarism being peddled.

2 Corinthians 6:14

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5) Mormon Interest
     In this role James even floated a planned publication, a "Jewish Book of Mormon". Notice how James planned to stimulate a market, copy an existing version, do some updates, and then do the sales and promotion. James never brought this one to completion, switching gears to a bigger market, naive Messianics fascinated with anything that says Hebrew, or even Aramaic.

    Here is James in his roles as "Yosef benYehudah - Rabbi Yosef" Please notice the methodology proposed, exactly what he has done in all his projects, except here James was acknowledging his planned base text.
.
http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/mormon/p1280ry.htm
"Yosef benYehudah" Fri Apr 23, 1999 [jewishbom] IDEA
"2. The organization could publish the Jewish Book of Mormon that I have been working on. (A Messianic Jewish Edition of the Book of Mormon)"

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/mormon/p2147ry.htm"Yosef benYehudah" <rabbiyosef@h...> 07 Oct 1999 [chofjclist] What is Jewish Book of Mormon?
" the Jewish Book of Mormon will do these same things with the Book of Mormon (the base text I am using is the 1830 edition).... Jesus > Yeshua John > Yochanan .... Church > Assembly Apostle > Emissary.......There will also be many footnotes to the text which will bring out its Jewishness."

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/mormon/p2154ry.htm
"Yosef benYehudah" 07 Oct 1999 Re: What is Jewish Book of Mormon?
"It is no more wrong to translate the BoM into Jewish english than it is to translate it into French, Spanish or German."

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/mormon/p2172ry.htm
"Yosef benYehudah" <rabbiyosef@h...> 09 Oct 1999 Hebrew Book of Mormon
SELECTIONS FROM THE BOOK OF MORMON IN HEBREW
1981 Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ LDS
.... I will check into obtaining rights to do number one.

"Yosef benYehudah" <rabbiyosef@h...> Fri Oct 22, 1999 [bom-messianic] Hebrew behind BoM
     One of the key elements which brought me to conclude that the BoM is authentic was discovered by me while reading a booklet which was attempting to disprove the BoM. This booklet was comparing BoM passages to the Bible...

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/2671/Rabbi.html
     A few months ago I also came to the conclusion that the Book of Mormon is a Jewish book. ...I continue to practice Judaism in light of the New Testament and the Book of Mormon, and interpret both as Jewish books. ... My reasons for remaining annonymous are obvious. These conclusions, if attached to me, would ruin me as a reliable Jewish scholar.

And for more information on all of this, and the various deceptions, read
http://www.seekgod.ca/rabbiyosef.htm -
James Trimm as Rabbi Yosef

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6) Personal Behavior

Not the purview of this discussion. We will simply mention that these issues included improper reading material, his wife's soap opera forum, the circumstances of the divorce and second marriage, and the history with Messianic fellowships, a brush with the law, and other issues.

We will however, mention one almost humorous aspect. We know of James' propensity to emphasize references or accolades or to imply a close relationship with those who are deceased, such as the scholar Dr. Cyrus Gordon. The latest twist of the personal discussions went one step further , and even includes deathbed recantation. As referred to in the “slander” page, and also other emails, Kit Ballantyne summarizes,

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nazarene_fraud_victims/message/177
Kit D Ballantyne Mon Jan 12, 2004 [Fwd: Re: I want my money back, plain and simple.]]
"his CURRENT wife claims his EX wife recanted her testimony right before dying. How convenient."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

7) James "Slander" Web response.

James "response" is full of so many red herrings, misrepresentations, misemphasis, deceptions and diversions that responding to it in full is another chore, and largely diversionary, since that is the nature of his responses. Most everything is covered on Kathryn and Vicky's websites. For now, it is far more important for folks to see the HRV plagiarism.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

8) English Competence
Reading James' work over the years, it became clear that James' English language spelling is atrocious, more in line with a mediocre high school student, or even grade school student, than a language expert... and his grammar was only marginally better than his spelling. Often folks puzzled why he didn't at least use a spell-checker and left glaring blunders in letters or articles designed for public consumption.

Even in the very limited quoting of this article there are…

recomend plagarized auired (acquired) wouth (would) amunition falsey interliniar recomendations degee

and more (some were typos, showing no proofreading… and some were spelling).

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

9) Doctorate and Course Transcript and DiplomaYou can actually see the supposed course transcript given by James at
http://www.nazarene.net/yeshiva/images/Faculty/eTranscript.tif

Really helpful is to see the larger versions, with notes. First go to ..
http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/falsedoctorate/doctoratedocumentation.html
Doctorate Documentation -
And then go to the section on "Transcript", read the intro and STUDY THIS DOCUMENT..http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/falsedoctorate/transcript.JPG
The supposed "Transcript Evaluation Record" ! (An unheard of terminology for a transcript :-).
We suggest, if nothing else, that everyone look at this document.You may never again see a transcript with the name of the granting Institution misspelled, on proportional word processing, no professors, no course dates, etc

Keep in mind that these, it turned out, upon further questioning, were supposed to be "correspondence courses", as revealed on the Messianic_Apologetic thread. With no designated teachers, or other students, or visible course materials.

Here is one of James' earlier descriptions... (misspelling included, as usual)

" Moreover my degree was earned. It was NOT awarded as an honorary degree nor was it purchased (as I said I was actually on a full scholarship). I have a certified transcript with real credit hours. The school also required three letters of recomendation from persons who have doctorates in the
field of religion in order to be awarded the degree of doctor. My degree required real credit hours, as well as three such recomendations. It was NOT the product of a diploma mill."More information at..
http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/falsedoctorate/falsedoctorateclaims.htmlAnd posts like http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5075
Schmuel Thu Jul 10, 2003 10 Questions for James Trimm re: his Transcript, Diploma, Doctorate
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/5088
Judy Miller Thu Jul 10, 2003
including the up and down web sites, the deceased "faculty", etc.

The SeekGod website has overviews
http://www.seekgod.ca/trimmdoc.htm
Doctor James Scott Trimm
including a summary of James' various doctorate claims, such as.
"PhD in Rabbinical Studies." (when acting as a morman)
"Doctorate in Semitic Studies"
"S.T.D. degee (Sacrae Theologae Doctor)"

http://www.seekgod.ca/trimmdiploma.htm
Doctor James Trimm's Diploma
http://www.seekgod.ca/trimmdiploma2.htm
James' Trimm's Diploma Revisited

Incidentally, Avi Ben Mordechai, who is mentioned in one article, has recently been moving away from rabbinical views based on Talmud that do not have support in Tanach, a very heartening change of perspective and teaching. We hope also that this is including also moving away from kabbalistic views. So, in terms of integrity, we hope that Avi will now step forward and clearly separate himself from James Trimm, and clearly publicly denounce the HRV plagiarism. Since they have been linked together for so long, and have promoted each other's activities, this may be a difficult step for Avi. However the day is long past (actually the day never was:-) for fence-sitting or closing ones eyes on the Integrity of the Scriptures.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(10) St. John Chrysostom Theological Seminary
Our summary in the body really covers the basics, a degree without any class courses, a phoney transcript, no teachers, no other students in the courses, etc. However, there are more details at ...

http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/yeshiva/sainthohn/saintjohnpage.htm
Saint John Chrysostom Theological Seminary

http://www.seekgod.ca/saintjohn.htm
Saint John Chrysostom Theological Seminary or St. John Chrysotom Theological Seminary. Saint John's - A Closer Look
Deceased "Current" Faculty
Gospel of Jesus Christ...Bagavad Gita..or Jewel of the Lotus ?

http://www.seekgod.ca/stjemail.htm
Discussions about the short-lived attempt, apparently by David Hargis, encouraged by James Trimm, to revive the public visibility of the institution this year, at least in terms of a web page. Clearly James desired the institution to keep some sort of public presence.
http://www.seekgod.ca/hargisnewsflash.htm
July 17.2003- The website is no loner online.

This issue is one that we will stop for a second and note a part of James' response… http://www.trimmfamily.com/Slander.htm
James gives us a textbook case of his ignoring all the real issues, using a misrepresentation and then trying to counter his own misrepresentation.

"No Other Students ? The Slanderers have claimed that there were never any other students of the Seminary. Although I do not know of many of them personally I have no doubt that there were MANY other students over the Seminaries twenty year plus history. A quick search of the internet turned up two persons who mention having been students of the Seminary in their credentials posted on the web. No doubt there are many more who do not have this fact posted in the internet."

   However, we weren’t discussing what might have happened 10 or 20 years earlier when the seminary was based in San Francisco, before Don Hargis took on the name for his operations.
And I pointed out that there were no other students for the 39 courses that James claimed to take.
"no known students, for all 39 courses, other than James Trimm"

    These were supposed to be "demanding" courses, and yet James never met a student and doesn't know the names of any of the teachers in the courses. Please, James.

    So in response James simply mentions two students from on the Internet, one of which was actually listed as the school treasurer and acknowledged that she never took any real courses (Alicia), that she knew Don Hargis and he granted her the degree, essentially in an honorary sense. And a second who lists the Seminary in an earlier stage in San Francisco and does not claim any particular courses or degrees :-) Wow.

MBI
Also you can find the history of many of the MBI (Messianic Bureau International) organization www.messianic.com embroiled in this controversy. MBI has placed the onus for some the problems on David Hargis in Texas, and for “Mountain West” on another, as separate from MBI in Virginia. We have met Donald Hargis and many MBI’ers at their conference in Virginia, and have some respect for their attempted Yeshiva.

Vicky especially has a lot of material, which is largely outside our current purview. http://www.seekgod.ca/mbiyeshiva.htm
MBI Yeshiva & The Hargis Clan - where you will find the
http://www.seekgod.ca/creditchart.htm
"Table of Credentials"

An educational organization does not need any particular degrees among its faculty simply to operate.

Even more so, if it were possible, a religious institution. And we have not done that much first-hand research on these issues. Was Lael only a diploma mill, or was it part of a true Church of the Nazarene campus ? Are we really concerned with issues of state licensing, as believers, or only proper and fair representation. My views are much less combative on this issue of Yeshiva than either Kathryn or even more so Vicky. And our view here is that generally many of these Yeshiva-educational issues are far less important than the HRV plagiarism The students at MBI are apparently generally satisfied, and the discussions of degrees and accreditation are far better today than when these issues first broke. We will defer at this time at either supporting or attacking the MBI Yeshiva.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

11) Seekgod.ca Vicky Dillen

Vicky Dillen’s website www.seekgod.ca is quite controversial. We have used mostly for its wealth of simple straight forward documentation, clarity and organization. And we find a lot of her research excellent and compelling, even in such issues as kabbalistic tendencies, and acceptance of false rabbinical precepts in the Messianic movement. On the other hand we find sometimes an excess of associative material (A spoke at a conference where B and C also spoke), and we don’t agree with the across the board anti-charismatic-Messianic-HebrewRoots perspective. We continue to discuss a lot of this with Vicky, both on forums like Messianic_Apologetic, and also in a general sense. For example, Vicky has an article coming out shortly on “The Message” paraphrase version that sounds like it will be an excellent discussion.

12) plagiarismn 1: a piece of writing that has been copied from someone else and is presented as being your own work WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University www.dictionary.com .

NOTE: We do not conjecture at all here whether James is aware of the full extent of this breach of ethics. The human mind is capable of incredible amounts of rationalization and self-deception.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

13) The Way International
The Way International has gone through many changes in the years since this version. Whether they desire to enforce the copyright, or even if they had made any arrangements with James Trimm (none are public) is not the issue before us in this plagiarism. The HRV has been promoted, and distributed, with the understanding that it was a translation by James Trimm from Aramaic and Hebrew manuscripts. James never indicated that he had used another English text as the base underlying text. That qualifes 100% as plagiarism.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------14) Hebrew Matthew The earlier Matthew plagiarism, B'sorot Matti is documented by Kathryn at http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/plagiarisms/bsorotmatti.htm
B'sorot Matti
     We have now asked Kathryn to add to that page some extra information about Hugh Schonfield and his Hebrew translation of DuTillet. “An Old Hebrew Text of St. Matthew's Gospel, Hugh Schonfield; 1927”.

     This is based on the DuTillet Hebrew, and the book by Schonfield is often referenced by James Trimm. Ironically the Schonfield book is also used, along with the New King James Version, to supply the Matthew base text, then the text is subject to the usual matrix of changes such as Hebraizations and Nazarenizations.

     The reasonable conjecture is that the NKJV was available in computer text format as a starting point, and in addition this would allow some differences from the Schonfield manuscript, so the plagiarism might not be recognized and discovered as easily. So here, as with the rest of the HRV, James claimed that he did an original translation of Matthew, but actually used the translation labors of the late Hugh Schonfield and others.

     And re Matthew.... for awhile James Trimm was advertising this corrupt Middle Ages Matthew text with the deceptive phrase "original Hebrew". ie "Would you like to study the Book of Matthew from the original Hebrew?" Sure we would, if such a Book existed :-)

     Our understanding is that the Book of Hebrews is supposed to be changed to an alternate source in the full HRV.

    On the B'sorot Matthew, other sources knew of this plagiarism... note, even Rick Chaimberlin of Petah Tikvah Magazine wrote to me about this on 10/29/03, and I posted it in Messianic_Apologetic

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/6339
"seekerbentruth" Thu Nov 6, 2003 Subject: Re: vicky dillens response: part 1(thank you moderator)
"Trimm did an earlier translation of Matthew based on an ancient Hebrew text, which Bill Lowe (deceased) said was based almost entirely on the translation done by Hugh Schonfield."

Bill Lowe was the editor of The Messianic Herald, an excellent newsletter, and a very careful and knowledgeable writer, and concerned with Scriptural integrity.

Ironically, Richard Chaimberlin's earlier review of the HRV (Vol. 19, No. 4 Oct-Dec 2001) in Petah Tikvah had been favorable, and has been used extensively by James for promoting the HRV, as in his email campaign
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sanj-update/message/481
James Trimm Date: Thu Oct 23, 2003 Subject: Messianic Study Bible

Richard has recently (December 28, 2003) sent a letter to James, including ...
"I would request you to remove the quote from the review that I did for your book"

James has NOT done as requested, and still posts the quote everywhere (Richard, please note)
http://www.trimmfamily.com/hrv
http://www.hebraicrootsversion.com/hrvreview.html
http://www.hebraicrootsversion.com/hrvnt.html

Despite what we would call a faux pas in the 2001 review, overall Petah Tikvah magazine is very possibly the single most interesting and friendly Messianic publication http://www.petahtikvah.com/

REVIEWSFor completeness, another review is at http://www.tnnonline.net/theonews/thebible/hrv/
Feb 7, 2002 Hebraic-Roots Version "New Testament," Bible Review by John K. McKee
John is currently considering an update, as he researches the full information on the background of SANJ, James Trimm and the HRV.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

15) Use of Peshitta rather than Old Syriac as Base

    Putting aside for the moment that James was using an English translation of the Peshitta, rather than Aramaic , the usage of a Peshitta text is especially ironic because James had constantly fought against the Peshitta Text in his dialogs with the "Aramaic Primacists".   The AP’s are those who consider the Peshitta as an inspired and preserved text. So James, to be consistent, would have been expected to "translate", or more in his style.. find and use.. an Old Syriac text, using only use the Peshitta in those sections where there was no Old Syriac text..

    There are only a couple of Old Syriac manuscripts, and even combined they do not give us the NT, substantial sections are missing, perhaps 20% of the NT. So any Old Syriac translation would have to augment somewhat from another source, such as the Peshitta.

    Understand that finding a useable English version of the Old Syriac that would not have to be laboriously typed in would be very difficult. (The Peshitta Text is in a format that would be easy to scan and OCR, and possibly was made available in a computer file). So James simply used a translation of Peshitta into English and then modified limited sections to match another Old Syriac source.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

16) Sources of “Value-Added” Modifications - Old Syriac and Aramaic Footnote Changes
    The source of James' Old Syriac updates to the AEINT, and the various other updates and footnotes is an interesting study. Remember that James has indicated the books that that he used, and apparently has available the works of Charles Torrey, Matthew Black, Frank Zimmerman, Charles Burney, Max Wilcox and Sandford and others (Burkett). James has already published many of these updates in his former work "The Semitic Origin of the New Testament", sometimes with attribution. Apparently , both update and the footnotes in the HRV are simply taken without attribution from various semitic origin books and translations (Etheridge and Murodoch).
http://www.nazarene.net/hrv/hebaram.html
TRANSLATED FROM HEBREW AND ARAMAIC
C. C. Torrey; Documents of the Primitive Church 1941; p. 160
Remains of a Very Ancient Recension of the Four Gospels in Syriac; Dr. William Cureton; 1858
The Old Syriac Gospels or Evangelion da-Mepharreshe; Agnes Smith Lewis; 1910
R. E. Y. Scott
Of course, it is easy for James to know what verses he changed from the AEINT Text, because that was his actual "value-added" to the plagiarized text. eg. From an Old Syriac source (2) or a discussion of semiticisms, he simply updated the text for those particular verses that fit his sources, leaving the great bulk of the Aramaic Peshitta AEINT text alone.

Usually James shows the places where he adjusted the text to match his particular points of modification, (above) such as Hebraizations and Nazarenizations, or spots where he made an Old Syriac modification.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------17) Textual Theories

    The claimed sources for the various Trimm translations, such as the Old Syriac, the DuTillet/Munster Middle Ages Matthew, and the Crawford Revelation, all have major problems from a textual level. And, most significantly, they make up a disjointed smorgasbord combined for your textual confusion. For example, the Peshitta Matthew is actually closer to the Greek Textus Receptus (which SANJ will not use) Matthew than it is to DuTillet, both in terms of scribal quality and textual readings. And ShemTob, which James often references in his writings, has dozens of corruptions, latinisms and absurd readings. This hodge-podge of conflicting sources is combined in the Trimm discussions more to augment an air of pseudo-scholarship authority, which ultimately can be sold to the gullible, than to enlighten. There simply is no textual harmony between these very sources, and trying to give the impression that there is represents a mockery of the Preservation of the Scriptures.

Textual theories - Middle Ages Matthew
    An excellent book for having an overview of the Hebrew Matthew issues is "Hebrew in the Church" by the late Pinchas E. Lapide. Eerdman 1984. (Lapide is also author of "The Messiah Texts" highly recommended for any believers library. Although Pinchas Lapide, as far as we know, never declared faith in Yeshua as Messiah, he brought sincere and strong scholarship to the table ).

    More and more information is coming out about the true and full nature of the ShemTob and DuTillet/Munster problems, corruptions, actual histories, and weaknesses and absurdities for use in any translation endeavor. Ironically, a lot of the information comes out the ShemTob pots calling the Munster/DuTillet kettles black, and visa versa. Future papers plant to address this in more detail, as well as the "lunar sabbath" deception that has been especially touching qodesh name circles.

    Overall, textual issues can be an involved and deep, ongoing separate dialog, with many diverse and competing theories. We welcome that dialog in the Messianic_Apologetic or the new forum mentioned in the body. However we consider much of the theories of James Trimm as simply "mush",. like nailing jelly to a tree, designed to allow for a translation from the particular unusual and conflicting manuscripts that he has purported to translate.

    The plagiarism essentially trumps all the theories, making them of no consequence. However, in other venues, we are happy to dialog and share on various theories of NT origin, including the claims of Semitic original manuscripts.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------18) The YATI - Moshe Koniuchowsky - Attack Campaign
    James began an Internet email "shoot the messenger" disinformation campaign, leading to Moshe Koniuchowsky of YATI to unleash a bitter and vitriolic attack on Kathryn, to his utter disrepute. We now call publicly on Moshe to retract this attack, a severe stain upon his reputation, and offer Kathryn Kern a public and sincere apology. This shameful history is best documented on the website of Vicky Dillenhttp://www.seekgod.ca/kon.htm . If you are an acquaintance of Moshe, or part of his organization, or receive materials from him, you might want to share your displeasure on the unScriptural stance he has taken. If they remain unresponsive, reconsider any affiliations with YATI and related organizations, such as the Union of Nazarene Yisraelite Congregations (UONYC), which have various dealings with James Trimm. They apparently put ethics very low on their agenda, as indicated not only by their unwillingness to expose the Trimm HRV plagiarism, but also to actually begin new relationships with Trimm’s organization and “attack the messenger”. Tacky and tawdry and sad.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------19) Herb Jahn and the ExeGeses Bible and the Aramaic New Covenant
     We can offer little additional comment about the projects of Herb Jahn. The exeGeses Bible and the Aramaic New Covenant are not in the public eye, Herb Jahn is deceased, the web page ishttp://www.exegesesbibles.org/ . Clearly James and Herb had disagreements, especially financial, but, unlike the HRV, there is no real publicity or sales for this version, neither in the Messainic community, the Aramaic community, or the Christian community at large.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------20) Lashon Hara
    A favorite tactic, when unrighteousness is exposed, is to attempt to "shoot the messenger" with the accusation "lashon hara" (Hebrew for "evil tongue") A full discussion of this is outside our current purview. At times I remember extracting material from Chofetz Chaim to demonstrate those places
where "lashon hara" is actually required, often in this very sense of the current warning, a watchman on the wall for protection of brethren from harm.. (Lashon hara, by definition, can be true or false, however it will harm someone, eg. their reputation). One other interesting post from Messianic_Apologetic shows we should be cautious in embracing all the rabbinical concepts.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/723
Schmuel Wed Nov 14, 2001 [Messianic_Apologetic] lashon hara - rabbinical caveat, James

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

NOTES FOR FINAL DRAFT

16) Beit Din The Current socalled International Nazarene Beit Din http://www.nazarene.net/beitdin/ The history of this supposed leadership organization is rather confused, mostly a vehicle for James to claim an illegitimate authority.

Kathryn has a lot of SANJ Beit Din history at http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/chronoinitial/beitdin/beitdinpage.html

Very significant historically is the Michael Detweiler apology to Kathryn at http://www.lebtahor.com/truth/trimm/chronoinitial/beitdin/mdletterofapology.html
While James claims on the "slander" page about the Beit Din..
"An independent committee was formed to investigate the matter and the committee exonerated me of all of her accusations."
Michael Detweiler, who was on the Beit Din, says...
"What I can offer you is a sincere apology for my involvement in the hurtful and hateful situation that evolved between yourself, James Trimm, and the SANJ Beit Din, though, if you recall, from the beginning I urged James to apologize and put the matter to rest. In my view, James Trimm has damaged you .... You did not lie about James, and have spoken facts regarding him. He has not denied the facts that you ... the facts that you presented remain credible.... , no lashon hara and no slander was committed. I apologize to you for making those statements.
As these things began to unfold, I communicated with the Beit Din and with James to offer you a credible apology. You did not receive this apology from him [them] and proceeded to expose error. It was wrong that they did not attempt to offer a credible apology."We referenced these two URL's, and more, at Kathryn's post on Messianic_Apologetic
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/6452
The 3 other current Beit Din members are Joe Veil, Eric Sandquist and Danny Harris. We feel all three are accountable to some extent for the HRV and SANJ fiasco for staying on the Beit Din without a public word about the ethical issues. All are tainted. Eric is little known, works closely with James Trimm on projects, and has received a showcase Internet web client with unknown financial remuneration. Danny Harris is also little known, apparently he leads a small "Nazarene/Messianic". fellowship in Columbus, Ohio. He did not respond earlier to an email sent about the HRV problems. Joe Veil has worked closely with James, and apparently uses SANJ as a vehicle to push his own textual views, especially in the email forums. His silence when presented with the HRV evidence, his unwillingness to "come out from among them", has tainted all his own work. We suspect when he finally leaves, he will try to play the innocent, but he has known for a long time about the HRV plagiarism.

SIDENOTE:
One of the more ironic issues was the (perhaps temporary) implementation by the (mostly Gentile) Beit Din of a very strange and disingenuous "Jewish only" requirement, which was used to remove one questioner from the Beit Din. That information is documented on the websites, as well.

Over time, many resigned or were taken off the Beit Din or were disfellowshipped from SANJ, some left with public letters, meanwhile at least one other former Beit Din member even left faith in Yeshua as Messiah.

Their were so many distortions, and shameful episodes, with James' manipulating this Beit Din, that we will pass on this long post on going into any more of these issues. If requested, we will add short summaries and the URL's.

Saturday, May 12, 2012

Hebraic-Roots Version NT Plagiarism

1 Cor 5

No comments:

Post a Comment

Leaving Jesus

Purposeful Love by Mrs. Lori Palatnik How to rectify senseless hatred.

Noah's Ark & Six Constant Mitzvot

WHY JESUS DIDN'T HAVE TO DIE to Atone for Sin

ShareThis

Blog Archive